Talk:The Sentinels of the Emperor

there are no imperial guardsmen assigned to or who fight alongside Space Marines, the resoning logic for this from the lore is that Space Marine Chapters are autonomus entities who on risk of there corruption and/or betrayal if given direct command over imperial forces could pose a even more significan threat than they already would. this logic comes all they back from 10 thousand years in the imperial past during the horus heresy where the bulk of the Imperial army betrayed the emperor becouse they either had no idea of what they were doing and simply had followed the commands of their space marine supperiors, or those who had known were essentially forced into compliance as they had been dependant on the space marines for the bulk of their heavy support.

also as space marines are essentially a independant force following pretty much only the commands of their company commanders or their chapter master, while the imperial guard obey a long line of commanders going all the way to their segmentum command it would be near impossible for the two forces to simply stay side by side.

as a final note, Imperial guard don't own their own ships, unlike space marines, imperial guard basically catch rides from imperial navy ships. Think of this as similar to how the US airforce, US navy and the US army are seperate branches, however the Navy and Airforce both transport the troops of the Army to where they need to be when the time comes for their forces to deploy, the army doesn't own the planes and the boats they just hitch a ride. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 06:53, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

A few things about them being Siege units. The Numbers in their Regiment is Extremely Low for a Siege Regiment. Siege is very static Warfare and is very costly in terms of lives and resources, Which is why most Siege Armies need to have very high numbers, and be able to replace their losses quickly, such as the Death Korps of Krieg. Also Astartes, while they can practice Siege aren't the best suited for it. With only 1000 Battle Brothers, even with supporting elements like Tanks and Other Heavy Armored Units would suffer catastrophic Losses against entrenched foes after a while, and Space Marines are far harder to replace than Guardsmen. Just food for thought. Blackdamp (talk) 08:51, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

So, about those reasons above.

"Army has no boats" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ships_of_the_United_States_Army)

"Army has no Aircraft" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Aviation_Branch)

SM still answer to earth. Earth just lets them be for the most part as if they say no, noone can really force them. (http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120703093321/warhammer40k/images/5/51/ImperialAdministrativeStructure.jpg) I agree that the IG numbers are far too low for protracted sieges; he may want to add an extra zero or two. He should probably make the IG regiment into chapter serfs that are allowed to fight. This would solve the problem with having humans permanently attached to SM as well as having a personal navy and number problems with sieges.50.83.92.230 18:29, November 18, 2014 (UTC) Hanith

ok wikia contributor great job linking things from WW2, good to know you also pretend to know history, too bad the united states airforce when it broke from the army took the whole aviation branch with it, and those boats in the other link don't exist anymore as the USA uses the mixed forces doctirne, otherwise you'd actually have an arguement there, but here is another point

1) Imperial navy and Imperial guard are seperated by order of THE HIGH LORDS OF TERRA. that means nope, the guard has no ships. they did this on fear of another horus heresy type event. not even you have to be of higher rank than a general (lord commander or warmaster) to be able to exibit any type of command over the navy.

2) chapter serfs are not allowed to join in battle as sodliers unless it's in self defence, otherwise it is interprited by the HIGH LORDS OF TERRA, as the chpater trying to form a military of their own and possibly even a empire of their own. which well the Badab war ruined anyone but the ultramarines' chances of building a SM empire.  the whole reason why they can't have guard with them doesn't stem first and foremost from them being in diffrent branches, it comes first and foremost from the fact the rest of the Imperium would view it as a threat.

sorry random wiki contributor i replied slightly offensively, and i truly appologize ArcCaptain there based off cannon friendliness there isn't many ways to save the guard keeping them with their SM buddies. However making a chapter of SM who are known to work well with many diffrent IG regiments might work out better.

Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 19:32, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

About "pretending to know history", your statement of "... united states airforce when it broke from the army took the whole aviation branch with it" is simply wrong.

Please read and note the listed still-active US Army regiments consisting of both VTOL and fixed-wing aircraft:    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Army_aircraft_battalions

The following is from the US Army website; also showing VTOL aircraft and possible job opportunities:    http://www.goarmy.com/about/army-vehicles-and-equipment/army-helicopters-and-uavs.html

"Mixed Forces"  (aka Combined Arms) gives each branch of a military its own assets of various systems. This lets each branch become more effective due to bypassing logistic issues with having to communicate with a different branch. This means while the Navy has many boats, it also has aircraft and ground forces. While the Air Force has many planes and missiles, it also has boats and ground forces (yes, the US airforce has a few ships). While the Army has many ground units, it also has air assets and boats. This is opposed to the "Segragated Arms" method that you keep alluding to (Air Force has only aircraft, Navy has only ships, Army has only ground forces).

List of still active aircraft for all branches of US military:    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_United_States_military_aircraft

Article regarding USAF's "navy":    http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/milarticles/blafnavy.htm

Chapter serfs only being allowed to fight in defence, while that is the mode of things, is not exclusively true. All context I can find, regarding the subject of chapter serfs not fighting, is due to their SM counter-parts seeing them as too frail to deal with the fights the SM are going to; not that terra has passed a law (I've read 2 articles on the Badab War now. None talk of any law passed after it regarding chapter serfs). Also, due to the literally infinite number of SM chapters out there, at least one will have formed its serfs into a cohesive fighting unit (or at the very least made its initiation process be survive X number of active wars).50.83.92.230 20:59, November 18, 2014 (UTC)Hanith

the law was in place after the Horus heresy, it just gets ignored from time to time. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 21:26, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Okay random Wikia contributor, I have no idea about how the United States's army is formed, but I do know how the armies of the Imperium of Man is formed. The sole only Imperial Guard regiment that I know to have its own attached fighter/bombers, is Harakoni Warhawks which is Drop Regiment of the Imperial Guard. Though, the starships of the Imperium are owned, governed and commanded by the Imperial Fleet (aka Navy), which has nothing to do with the Imperial Guard. I am glad you have found that picture from the 6th Edition rulebook, as you are aware about the fact that Space Marines are under jurisdiction of Adeptus Administratum, you are propably also aware of the fact that Imperial Fleet and Guard are two separate branches. As you can see from the picture on the right. Even if the same picture tells us that Navis Nobilite is under jurisdiction of Imperial Fleet, that ain't true (wholly) either. You see, Imperial military is actually led by department called Departmento Munitorum which coordinates the Fleet to assist Guard troops who make planetfall and sacrifice themselves in numbers. Then again, Departmento Munitorum is an organization, which is ruled by high ranking members of Adeptus Administratum, Imperial Guard (aka Astra Militarum), and Estate Imperium. Imperial Fleet however has to rely on Adeptus Mechanicus quite heavily indeed for the tech-priests are only who can fix their little spaceships. So all in all, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, which is fine, if you'd only have the wits to shut up. Only occasion when elements of the Fleet and Guard would be commanded by one body, is when a crusade has a warmaster. Then all forces are under direct jurisdiction of the warmaster, because the warmaster is nominated by the High Lords of Terra, the rank being so influential and powerful that no lesser men should ever be allowed to pass the rank on.

I understand this might all be very confusing, especially when we add the Space Marines which are really their own independent forces as described in every single Codex: Space Marines and even in the newest (7thE) rulebook of the tabletop game.

And in addition as a final note. Space Marine chapters are not allowed to field non-Astartes armies because of the reason given above by Plague. If that is not enough for you, you can just check our rules which say the same and stop whining. Thank you very much. -- Remos talk 23:07, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Author here. Sooo....yea, I'd like to know why it was deemed necessarry to ban my IP under "Harassment and Intimidation" Furthermore, slapping a label that says my fluff "reakes of Matt Ward" is extrememly disrespectful as is the way you treated the people posting on this talk page. Not only disrespectful, but childish in the arguments caused and unproffesional in how the discussion was conducted on this discussion page. I'll add that stomping your feet and demanding your word final on your personal opinions on the fluff, is childish as well. Thricely, I understand there are things that are concrete in the 40k universe (marines being superhuman, Nids being xenos, etc) however, what you deemed "incorrect" in my fluff, is not. There are literally THOUSANDS of chapters and millions of guardsmen formations, you cannot possibly assume all of them are 100% cut and paste, and play by the rules. Especially when it was written that an Inquisitor was heading their operations. Inquisitors, in case you don't know, carry a heavy title and can bend/break the rules as they see fit for the better of mankind.

Now that I can finally speak with that unnesessary ban lifted, I'll just say that I honestly don't care if I'm kicked from the site. The thousands of people in the Warhammer groups I'm in plus the chaps that defended me on this page, seem to like it. That and I also have pen and paper to fall back on. If you feel that how you interpret the fluff is how it HAS to be, so be it. I will not be a part of a website that tyrannically forces authors to bend to how they percieve the fluff and put temporary bans for reasons that are astronomically off base. -ArcCaptain

Ok, arc, 1) i senserly appologise for being immature fighting with random wiki contrubtor. However one of the standing rules of the site has been that GW canon takes priority. I was trying to be helpful and intended to provide alternative possibilites (though i am unsure how some of them would work out in the end) but I got caught up in some obvious debate bait.

That aside i am unsure how or even who banned you, of it was intentional or not. There'd been of a ban issue on the site this year.

My intent is only to suggest some excellent alternatives, such as Servitor Auxila, as Servitors technically do not fall under any of the definitions for soldiers laid out by the high lords of Terra. (Same as how the Sisters of Battle bypass the edit of the high lords of terra stating that the Ecclesiarchy should have no ken at arms. Other possibilities is one i actually implemented in which my Chapter keeps a much larger than normal amount of Scouts. (1 for every marine) as they do not technically count as SM until they have had the gene-seed implemented

As for your statement about the tyranical admins, well we did have a tyrant once, he's gone. But the rules stated are to stave off the anarchy that once existed where a single SM chapter had a titan legion larger than all titan legions, Tau and eldar weapons and could conquer the whole galaxy of they felt like. As part of the plan to stave off that bad writing and utter isiocracy, the admins and many users agreed that having thw canon be ultimately be superior to what is writen here (if only just) would deter writers from creating empires of super space hippies who kill all necrons because one of the crons stepped on a flower. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 04:32, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

From one admin to another, I completely understand not wanting your site to fall to anarchy. However, I do feel my fluff is still far from the "all of my marines are Draigo" nonsense. My goal is to essentially gather a mid-tier force army for my Inquisitor. As for who banned me, I was informed by the site thet it was RemosPendragon. I appologize for any offense, I've been watching for the last three days unable to do something with a label on my fluff that claimed it reeked of matt ward. I was kind of steaming in all honesty. Thank you for your understanding.