Talk:The Sentinels of the Emperor

there are no imperial guardsmen assigned to or who fight alongside Space Marines, the resoning logic for this from the lore is that Space Marine Chapters are autonomus entities who on risk of there corruption and/or betrayal if given direct command over imperial forces could pose a even more significan threat than they already would. this logic comes all they back from 10 thousand years in the imperial past during the horus heresy where the bulk of the Imperial army betrayed the emperor becouse they either had no idea of what they were doing and simply had followed the commands of their space marine supperiors, or those who had known were essentially forced into compliance as they had been dependant on the space marines for the bulk of their heavy support.

also as space marines are essentially a independant force following pretty much only the commands of their company commanders or their chapter master, while the imperial guard obey a long line of commanders going all the way to their segmentum command it would be near impossible for the two forces to simply stay side by side.

as a final note, Imperial guard don't own their own ships, unlike space marines, imperial guard basically catch rides from imperial navy ships. Think of this as similar to how the US airforce, US navy and the US army are seperate branches, however the Navy and Airforce both transport the troops of the Army to where they need to be when the time comes for their forces to deploy, the army doesn't own the planes and the boats they just hitch a ride. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 06:53, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

A few things about them being Siege units. The Numbers in their Regiment is Extremely Low for a Siege Regiment. Siege is very static Warfare and is very costly in terms of lives and resources, Which is why most Siege Armies need to have very high numbers, and be able to replace their losses quickly, such as the Death Korps of Krieg. Also Astartes, while they can practice Siege aren't the best suited for it. With only 1000 Battle Brothers, even with supporting elements like Tanks and Other Heavy Armored Units would suffer catastrophic Losses against entrenched foes after a while, and Space Marines are far harder to replace than Guardsmen. Just food for thought. Blackdamp (talk) 08:51, November 17, 2014 (UTC)

So, about those reasons above.

"Army has no boats" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ships_of_the_United_States_Army)

"Army has no Aircraft" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Aviation_Branch)

SM still answer to earth. Earth just lets them be for the most part as if they say no, noone can really force them. (http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20120703093321/warhammer40k/images/5/51/ImperialAdministrativeStructure.jpg) I agree that the IG numbers are far too low for protracted sieges; he may want to add an extra zero or two. He should probably make the IG regiment into chapter serfs that are allowed to fight. This would solve the problem with having humans permanently attached to SM as well as having a personal navy and number problems with sieges.50.83.92.230 18:29, November 18, 2014 (UTC) Hanith

ok wikia contributor great job linking things from WW2, good to know you also pretend to know history, too bad the united states airforce when it broke from the army took the whole aviation branch with it, and those boats in the other link don't exist anymore as the USA uses the mixed forces doctirne, otherwise you'd actually have an arguement there, but here is another point

1) Imperial navy and Imperial guard are seperated by order of THE HIGH LORDS OF TERRA. that means nope, the guard has no ships. they did this on fear of another horus heresy type event. not even you have to be of higher rank than a general (lord commander or warmaster) to be able to exibit any type of command over the navy.

2) chapter serfs are not allowed to join in battle as sodliers unless it's in self defence, otherwise it is interprited by the HIGH LORDS OF TERRA, as the chpater trying to form a military of their own and possibly even a empire of their own. which well the Badab war ruined anyone but the ultramarines' chances of building a SM empire.  the whole reason why they can't have guard with them doesn't stem first and foremost from them being in diffrent branches, it comes first and foremost from the fact the rest of the Imperium would view it as a threat.

sorry random wiki contributor i replied slightly offensively, and i truly appologize ArcCaptain there based off cannon friendliness there isn't many ways to save the guard keeping them with their SM buddies. However making a chapter of SM who are known to work well with many diffrent IG regiments might work out better.

Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 19:32, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

About "pretending to know history", your statement of "... united states airforce when it broke from the army took the whole aviation branch with it" is simply wrong.

Please read and note the listed still-active US Army regiments consisting of both VTOL and fixed-wing aircraft:    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Army_aircraft_battalions

The following is from the US Army website; also showing VTOL aircraft and possible job opportunities:    http://www.goarmy.com/about/army-vehicles-and-equipment/army-helicopters-and-uavs.html

"Mixed Forces"  (aka Combined Arms) gives each branch of a military its own assets of various systems. This lets each branch become more effective due to bypassing logistic issues with having to communicate with a different branch. This means while the Navy has many boats, it also has aircraft and ground forces. While the Air Force has many planes and missiles, it also has boats and ground forces (yes, the US airforce has a few ships). While the Army has many ground units, it also has air assets and boats. This is opposed to the "Segragated Arms" method that you keep alluding to (Air Force has only aircraft, Navy has only ships, Army has only ground forces).

List of still active aircraft for all branches of US military:    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_active_United_States_military_aircraft

Article regarding USAF's "navy":    http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/milarticles/blafnavy.htm

Chapter serfs only being allowed to fight in defence, while that is the mode of things, is not exclusively true. All context I can find, regarding the subject of chapter serfs not fighting, is due to their SM counter-parts seeing them as too frail to deal with the fights the SM are going to; not that terra has passed a law (I've read 2 articles on the Badab War now. None talk of any law passed after it regarding chapter serfs). Also, due to the literally infinite number of SM chapters out there, at least one will have formed its serfs into a cohesive fighting unit (or at the very least made its initiation process be survive X number of active wars).50.83.92.230 20:59, November 18, 2014 (UTC)Hanith

the law was in place after the Horus heresy, it just gets ignored from time to time. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 21:26, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Okay random Wikia contributor, I have no idea about how the United States's army is formed, but I do know how the armies of the Imperium of Man is formed. The sole only Imperial Guard regiment that I know to have its own attached fighter/bombers, is Harakoni Warhawks which is Drop Regiment of the Imperial Guard. Though, the starships of the Imperium are owned, governed and commanded by the Imperial Fleet (aka Navy), which has nothing to do with the Imperial Guard. I am glad you have found that picture from the 6th Edition rulebook, as you are aware about the fact that Space Marines are under jurisdiction of Adeptus Administratum, you are propably also aware of the fact that Imperial Fleet and Guard are two separate branches. As you can see from the picture on the right. Even if the same picture tells us that Navis Nobilite is under jurisdiction of Imperial Fleet, that ain't true (wholly) either. You see, Imperial military is actually led by department called Departmento Munitorum which coordinates the Fleet to assist Guard troops who make planetfall and sacrifice themselves in numbers. Then again, Departmento Munitorum is an organization, which is ruled by high ranking members of Adeptus Administratum, Imperial Guard (aka Astra Militarum), and Estate Imperium. Imperial Fleet however has to rely on Adeptus Mechanicus quite heavily indeed for the tech-priests are only who can fix their little spaceships. So all in all, you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about, which is fine, if you'd only have the wits to shut up. Only occasion when elements of the Fleet and Guard would be commanded by one body, is when a crusade has a warmaster. Then all forces are under direct jurisdiction of the warmaster, because the warmaster is nominated by the High Lords of Terra, the rank being so influential and powerful that no lesser men should ever be allowed to pass the rank on.

I understand this might all be very confusing, especially when we add the Space Marines which are really their own independent forces as described in every single Codex: Space Marines and even in the newest (7thE) rulebook of the tabletop game.

And in addition as a final note. Space Marine chapters are not allowed to field non-Astartes armies because of the reason given above by Plague. If that is not enough for you, you can just check our rules which say the same and stop whining. Thank you very much. -- Remos talk 23:07, November 18, 2014 (UTC)

Author here. Sooo....yea, I'd like to know why it was deemed necessarry to ban my IP under "Harassment and Intimidation" Furthermore, slapping a label that says my fluff "reakes of Matt Ward" is extrememly disrespectful as is the way you treated the people posting on this talk page. Not only disrespectful, but childish in the arguments caused and unproffesional in how the discussion was conducted on this discussion page. I'll add that stomping your feet and demanding your word final on your personal opinions on the fluff, is childish as well. Thricely, I understand there are things that are concrete in the 40k universe (marines being superhuman, Nids being xenos, etc) however, what you deemed "incorrect" in my fluff, is not. There are literally THOUSANDS of chapters and millions of guardsmen formations, you cannot possibly assume all of them are 100% cut and paste, and play by the rules. Especially when it was written that an Inquisitor was heading their operations. Inquisitors, in case you don't know, carry a heavy title and can bend/break the rules as they see fit for the better of mankind.

Now that I can finally speak with that unnesessary ban lifted, I'll just say that I honestly don't care if I'm kicked from the site. The thousands of people in the Warhammer groups I'm in plus the chaps that defended me on this page, seem to like it. That and I also have pen and paper to fall back on. If you feel that how you interpret the fluff is how it HAS to be, so be it. I will not be a part of a website that tyrannically forces authors to bend to how they percieve the fluff and put temporary bans for reasons that are astronomically off base. -ArcCaptain

Ok, arc, 1) i senserly appologise for being immature fighting with random wiki contrubtor. However one of the standing rules of the site has been that GW canon takes priority. I was trying to be helpful and intended to provide alternative possibilites (though i am unsure how some of them would work out in the end) but I got caught up in some obvious debate bait.

That aside i am unsure how or even who banned you, of it was intentional or not. There'd been of a ban issue on the site this year.

My intent is only to suggest some excellent alternatives, such as Servitor Auxila, as Servitors technically do not fall under any of the definitions for soldiers laid out by the high lords of Terra. (Same as how the Sisters of Battle bypass the edit of the high lords of terra stating that the Ecclesiarchy should have no ken at arms. Other possibilities is one i actually implemented in which my Chapter keeps a much larger than normal amount of Scouts. (1 for every marine) as they do not technically count as SM until they have had the gene-seed implemented

As for your statement about the tyranical admins, well we did have a tyrant once, he's gone. But the rules stated are to stave off the anarchy that once existed where a single SM chapter had a titan legion larger than all titan legions, Tau and eldar weapons and could conquer the whole galaxy of they felt like. As part of the plan to stave off that bad writing and utter isiocracy, the admins and many users agreed that having thw canon be ultimately be superior to what is writen here (if only just) would deter writers from creating empires of super space hippies who kill all necrons because one of the crons stepped on a flower. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 04:32, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

From one admin to another, I completely understand not wanting your site to fall to anarchy. However, I do feel my fluff is still far from the "all of my marines are Draigo" nonsense. My goal is to essentially gather a mid-tier force army for my lord Inquisitor. As for who banned me, I was informed by the site thet it was RemosPendragon. I appologize for any offense, I've been watching for the last three days unable to do something with a label on my fluff that claimed it reeked of matt ward. I was kind of steaming in all honesty. Thank you for your understanding. -ArcCaptain

while i feel a little honnored to be labeled as such i'm just a helpful user. the admins have been either unable to promote or their expectations horridly betrayed when they promote someone. I had firstly wanted to simply help a new face brainstorm a idea that would be easily passible with the admins and site rules, while also stepping in before a rude user found your page. i think as one of the users of this site i hold a slightly unque position of being a little of all worlds. Eye i'z da boy ooh iz da Dack-ub-eral-trades yer git.

but personally i hope you don't really take the rules too much in the wrong way, one of the things with the site is that the founders try to uphold what the angry marines stood for...an eternal hate for all things NCF. and they tried (orriginally) to encourage the users to be creative in finding ways around the limitations of canon instead of simply ignoring canon or mary sueing through it. the current Beucrat of the site Supahbadmarine examplifies this trait if you need an example, currently he made "the chaos god of greed" to both prevent others from trying and to create it in a way that this "chaos god of greed" wouldn't be some petty creation who'd render Slaanesh pointless. he's also writen a number of pages which both entirely (mostly) stay within the confines of the canon and still have the effect most of the "grandest of grand" empire writers aim (and fail) to achieve. why i bring him up is that both as a beuro and a writer of that level he's a generally good person to try contacting in situations where your aiming for an effect and the admins are gunning you down.

you saw my personal suggestions of simply using more scouts or servitors, so i don't have anything more at this time i could suggest but he is a good person to talk to if you want another option. Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 05:32, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

So the ideal way of getting someone to change their article, is to ban their IP for three days and prevent them from doing so? Food for tohught; as fellow admin, I might reccommend you not ban the person for making said mistake and instead allow them to fix said mistake as well as help them to. I mean sure, I have 27 more days to change it, but having to sit there and watch people argue ofver my work for three days without being able to give an opinions is senseless. Secondly, banning someone under harassment just because there is no better option is just silly. If you lack the option to ban because your rules are broken, make it an option or ask the creator of the domain to do so. Thricely, your instruction and feedback is lacking at best. Plague just admitted he isn't an admin and so I find myself asking why a non-admin is the one handing me helpful hints instead of the ones who asked me to change the page in the first place. For example, I had no idea what "Requires property (and construction) template(s)" meant? If you want these problems aliveated, you should assume you need to explain the exact problem and give a solution. Lastly, I'm not sure why you are still trying to pass this off as guard being owned by space marines. If you read the page, you'll see that they are all fighting under the direction of Lord Inquisitor. Lord Inquisitors again, in cas you don't know, have the authority to arrange things that are normally not allowed. So I feel I need to as why I cannot have a representetive of one of the most powerful organizations within the Imperium, granted a personal force of his own. Refer to the chart posted earlier in the discussion and you will see that the Inquisition wields the same power as the high lords. In fact, I think the only power the two do not share is of the affairs of the emperor himself.

random annon and i really made this a bigger mess than it should be. orriginal point i was making before the completion of the page, was a statment that IG own none of their own ships and SM don't lug around guardsmen in thier pockets and thus for the two to have been working together it would have had to be that the SM were following the ig around. at the time of that comment the Lord inquisitor bit was not writen in. though if you think about it IG following their idol space marines around not creepy, SM following IG around....pedobear.....

but there is from a lore standpoint going to need a bit on how these two impressed a lord inquisitor enough that he basicly turned to a ig regiment and said "i own ya bitches" and then turned to a chapter master and said, "look we have two options, either you fight with me to defend your freedoms as a chapter to do whatever the fuck you want....or you send a company to where i say now and then and we don't have a problem."

Lord inquisitors are powerful yes, but SM are proud and super idiotic...take the soul drinkers chapter for example. they got excomunicated cuz they wern't willing to share a relic that could have accelerated power weapons technology a few centuries to a millenia with the admech. and lets face it, admech have way more pull in the imperium than any chapter of SM. but back to the point,

how would these SM and guardsmen impress a inquisitor whose already got the deathwatch, and inquisitorial stormtroopers enough that he'd be willing to force a chapter of SM into doing as he said and kidnap a whole (and easily replaceable) regiment. no i am not against the idea, i'd just like to know how as i'm a details guy who thinks (just cuz) is  a poor writers excuse especially when i can smell a good story from the question/possibility.

Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 07:04, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

See now these are great suggestions. However I'm confused about you not seeing the inquisitor bit. Zaetoc Cain has been in the fluff since before I was banned on the 17th. Beyond that, I fully plan to expand on the finite details. These are editable articles after all and this will always be a WIP. As for why the Lord Inquisitor wants them over the easy pick of just requesitioning deathwatch, great question. The answers are;

A) His personality. Zaetoc is ecclectic in his methods. He would rather take 500 marines that have all worked together since their inception, over an organized multi-chapter squad. Another benefit from having them all from the same chapter is that he can mold them easier. A Lord Inquisitor is a clever sort, and knows if he can shape these warriors into an instrument of his needs, his plans go more smoothly. Why would Zaetoc want Guardsmen when he can pick Inquisitoial Stormtroopers? Well how do you think Stormtroopers join an Inquisitor in the first place? They are taken from regular ol' guardsmen.

B) As far as how they view each other. The fluff I plane to expand on, is essentially a short stint in which the marines and guard (I know scary scary fluff breaking) go about their personal vendetta crusade to find the Dark Eldar Succubus. The short stint was really only about twenty years, but inthat time, the two forces became known for their hatred and skill at fighting Xenos. Which, as my fluff states currently, caught the eye of the Lord Inquisitor. As far as how they got around, the marines found themselves with more ships than needed so their "extra" ships were equipped to ferry the Guard around. So to be honest, I really don't see why a few decades of Guard fighting with Marines is a big deal. If you really need convincing that it happens, read the fluff on the PDF of Ultramar. It says that their guard have been known to fight with the Ultramarines.

I might add that with the excpetion of "Inquisition" everything was categorized correctly already. I must have just forgotten to add the Inquisition, my fault.

Err, I did O.o?. My appologies. Note to self, avoid the puzzle pieces.

So might I ask what is still needed in my article?

As it was me who banned you, let me explain. Not that I did not already explain myself on your talk page, but I can do that again, because that's what I do. Explain things over and over again.

You might want to read this, which is my blog post, quite recent actually, where I clearly say that I am willing to take such ignorant acts, as leaving page without property and construction templates, as minor offense. You, on the other hand, blanked numerous articles of yours at short period of time, all of them lacking property and construction templates, so I did not ban you for minor offence but for moderate one. Blanking a page is a note for me that "author wants it deleted, please delete this" because so many of users seem to be unaware of the possibility to add "delete" template on their article. I could've just deleted all your articles, but I thought that maybe you are just a new user. Then again, you apparently hadn't red our rules because of the many simultaneous breaks, so I thought that a nice snap will do you good and maybe give you some time to spent with the rules instead of arguing on your article's talk page how wrong I was to do that.

Now, it clearly shows how much you know about 40k lore saying there are thousands of chapters, millions regiments perhaps, only thousand of chapters. Claiming that they work combined as brothers et cetera. We have here, as every page does, rules, that need to be followed. If you don't like them, you can write a blog post about it or come up with it in our Forum:Community_Discussion_Board and propose something different. If you'r article gets NCF tag, it is explained in talk page as it was and if you sincerely think it is not fairly given, you can pull one of our (admins) sleeves and ask him/her to come by to review the situation. Instead of calling me immature for following our rules. Breaking multiple rules simultaneously is "Intimidating behaviour and harassment of our site and userbase". I hope I do not need to clarify myself even more about this. -- Remos talk 08:11, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

Even Lord Inquisitors have limits to their Authority, Pulling an Entire Regiment of IG and an Entire SM Chapter under his command more that Exceeds that. Even one would be pushing it. A Kill Team of SM is one thing, and a Few Platoons in service to a More Militant Inquisitor is still do able. But the reason the SM are not allowed to field Non-Astartes Armies is the same reason the Imperium was split into so many pieces, and even why SM Legions became Chapters. To Limit the damage done by potential traitors. A single Inquisitor having Command of a Chapter of Astartes and a Regiment of Guardsmen of any Type would be far too much power under one persons command. Blackdamp (talk) 08:13, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

^This is completely wrong. There is fluff in which a Lord Inquisitor has pulled entire regiments before. Some soldiers were even kept as a personal retinue. So no, it's not at all "pushing it" for a Lord Inquisitor. Here is my reference, " Rex lobbied the entire Scarus conclave to obtain direct control over the war on Vraks and to induct the entire 88th Regiment of the Death Korps of Krieg into his own retinue." - Lexicanum on Lord Inquisitor Hector Rex. Again, I feel the need to ask why you are hung up on "Astartes fielding non-Astartes" That is NOT in my fluff. They work SIDE-BY-SIDE. The Guardsmen do NOT work for, or get deployed by the Marines.

Remos, while I appreciate your input, your timing is...off. We've gotten passed what you felt necessary to bring back up, as you can see above. Also allow me to ponder this. If this site is so keen on following fluff, and there is only 1,000 known chapters (250 known and 750 unrecorded), then why allow for non-canon chapters to be made? Sure the fluff allows for 750 chapters to be played with by us fans, but none are canon no matter how many rules they follow in making them. Secondly, I do believe your interpretation of 1,000 chapters is too literal. I'll quote the Lexi. "Over time, the number of chapters has grown, and is said to number around a thousand at the time of the 41st Millennium." In general terms, the phrase "It is said" is not something to rely on as concrete. 9/10 times, it is used to set up a legend or myth, which can be under or overplayed. It might as well be saying, "Legend says there are 1,000 chapters". This could be more or less for all we know. Thricely, The lexi dates that number during the 41st millennium. Sure we are "technically" still there, but we can spit and hit the 42nd at this point. Meaning, it's highly unlikely that there are still 1,000 chapters after 1,000 years.

TL:DR version, the problem with the canon you follow, as well as enforce, is that it's flawed. Which is probably why GW makes a lot of things flexible so that the fans can make their own fluff with the base they have built. Heck there have been times where GW has stated that you SHOULD be free to run with your fluff, just justify it.

If I may jump in for a moment. First of all there are numerous sources that state that the Imperium generally maintains 1000 Chapters at any given time, with a margin for error given that Chapters are sometimes destroyed. In addition I would also point out that we are not GW. They make allowances to fanmade fluff for the sake of their business. We simply have  a policy that articles should not contradict extsablished facts of the lore. Now regarding why we don't penalize the large number of Space Marine Chapters made here despite the finite number of Chapters within Canon is because it simply wouldn't be fair to ban users from making Chapters simply because we hit the limit of how many unidentified Chapters within the Canon. The same goes for Chaos Warbands given that it has been stated that around 60 full Chapters have fallen to Chaos since the Horus Heresy. I would also like to correct you on a comment you made before. Inquisitorial Storm Troopers are not recruited from the Guard. They are recruited from the Schola Progenium, and in particular they recruit members of families that have a history of service to the Inquisition. Anyway in summary if you don't like the rules regarding the canon then you are always free to write elsewhere, and responding to criticism with hostility is not helping your case. Also thanks for the compliment earlier Plague. I am your master! At your service. (talk) 08:43, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

I'll have to disagree on a few things. Regardless of why GW has allowed us to play with the fluff, the fact is, they do. Again, preferring we justify our actions, and not make a simple "all my marines can kill a titan" chapter, for example. Next we have the comment about meeting criticism with hostility. Criticism would imply that the users I've been hostile towards have given me constructive feedback on my fluff and how to correct it. Not just reiterating that I need to follow the rules over and over. Finally, the bit about the storm troopers. You're very correct, Stormtrooper is now a low-gothic term for Scions and Scions are indeed trained at the Schola Progenium. However, not all stormtroopers are trained there. Meaning planets like Cadia still keep and train their stormtroopers on-world and further meaning if their stormtroopers were recruited into the Inquisition, it would indeed prove that not all of them are recruited from the Schola. Although, I will add that most planets choose to replicate the conditions in which Scions are trained by the Schola to ensure they are just as good. Nice way to bridge the gap by GW.

Now, if we are quite finished discussing me, I'd like to get down to what is currently important. Could an admin help me figure out the last details I need to add so that my article may be relieved of all flags, please?

Simply because the criticism was not constructive does not excuse abandonning civility. It is understandable that certain comments have given you cause to ake offense, but you are still expected to reply in a mature manner. Also I should point out that this statement does not only apply to you in this case, as I have seen a few people lose their composure on this talk page. Also it is true that there are technically Storm Troopers that are raised among the Gaurd Regiments themselves. They are referred to under the colloquial of Grenadiers. However Grenadiers are not chosen for service as Inquisitorial Strom Troopers. Those are drawn exclusively from the Progenium, and as stated, mainly from recruits whose families have a history of service with the Inquisition. You have to understand that Inquisitorial Storm Troopers are exposed to secrets that the Inquisition can not trust to mere Guardsmen through the course of their work. I am your master! At your service. (talk) 09:04, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

I've not remotely lost my cool or civility in any way. in fact, I've carefully and calmly typed all of my replies slowly as to not say something uncivil. So I assure you I'm unsure what you're speaking on, but I hope you're not trying to troll me into staying in this unnecessary debate when I've clearly deemed it beneath me to continue. Again, I would actually like the important issue addressed instead.

Also, as a final note on the matter, I recommend you read up on your fluff as it sounded like you are trying to insist that grenadiers, and by extension, guardsmen aren't recruited by the inquisition. This is simply untrue. Anyone who has spent any time at all playing Dark Heresy, or reading the general fluff would know that anyone from a lowly conscript, to a hardened veteran can be recruited. All it takes is a simple act of bravery, recommendation or anyone of the inquisitor's network seeing you perform a deed that would make you fit for service.

Okay, there is a Difference between a Lord Inquisitor of Ordo Malleus with a Retinue of Grey Knights arriving to directly command a War Zone infested with Daemons and Traitor Marines and Having a Permenant Army at his Disposal. Blackdamp (talk) 09:16, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

No not really as none of the Ordos really trump another in power. And that Ordo Malleus Inquisitor now has an entire regiment at his command. All because he wanted to prevent an incursion. Where as my Lord Inquisitor now has approximately 500 marines and what is left of a guard regiment in his. Which was obtained via partnership, if you had read my fluff. Sort of a "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" agreement.

You are Right, They Don't. I only said Ordo Malleus cause they are the only one with Access to the Grey Knights. But again there is a Difference between taking a Regiment to Help Break a Siege and end an Incursion by Chaos, and having a Permenant IG attachment and SM Chapter. Blackdamp (talk) 09:26, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

I hate to drag the canon discussion on, but you are speaking about recruitment on an individual basis, which is at the discretion of the Inquisitor in question, and is based on the Inquisitor's needs for an individuals skills. However recruiting a few Gaurdsmen into the service of an Inquisitor does not amke them an Inquisitorial Storm Trooper. The ISTs are an asset maintained across the Inquisition as an institution, and are thus afforded special status. They are not recruited from normal Guardsmen. I am your master! At your service. (talk) 09:26, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

Ok everyone is jumping on a stormtrooper debate, but lets point out the real issue here, 1st the maleous Inquisitor inducted thpse guardsmen not as IST but as personal Retinue and i don't recall a mention of howmany IG surviving their clash with the deamons. Second is the issue that no lone inquisitor holds a chapter of SM under his command. It takes a whole ordo to keep eachother in check. Obviously the logic being that in the inquisition woth how close they draw to the very things they are supposed to destroy, they are more likely to go traitor (original Inquisition ordo malious was the only subsect of inquisition and ment to hunt traitor inquisitors)

While the idea of a inquisitor being such a ally to a SM chapter that the chapter often loans small forces to said inquisitor makes quite a bit more sense as that Inquisitor is quite a bit less likely to have another inquisitor knocking on his door with claims of treason. Revonor, and his mentor should both be decent examples to this case, while the risk of even one company of SM spending to much time with a inquisitor should also be noted as exemplified by the Blood Angels civil war, and the falsified reincarnation of their Primarch by said inquisitor.

Why i rant like this is well, inquisition track record with IG regiments is the IG end up all dead. Inquistion track record with SM companies has generally been end result traitors, even if thats not what the Inquistion intended, (see soul drinkers omnibus) Allow me a demonstration. This is your body...WITHOUT FIBER! (talk) 12:59, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

Author here, I'm glad we're on the same page now, and that you agree that an Inquisitor CAN take said entities under his wing. Allow me to continue to shed light on a few things as well on ::sigh:: reiterate on a couple of others.

A) The marines are not an entire chapter, so saying he has a full chapter under his command, would be false. Secondly, AGAIN, less under his command, and more under his guidance and working together to benefit one-another.

B) The guardsmen are what is left of a regiment, so unlike pre-established fluff in which an inquisitor has taken the entire 88th Krieg regiment, this one has taken maybe 3/4 of one.

C) I'll say again that I'm happy you have come to see the light in that it is possible for the Inquisitor to use his influence to gather these forces. As far as repercussions for his actions, that's for me to decide and not up to you, or a "based on these few incidents, it is likely that" situation. That is, unless you can provide concrete canotical proof he will undoubtedly be hunting down for working cooperatively with an approximately half-strength chapter and taking what's left of an Imperial Guard regiment into his ranks.

Also allow me to pick apart your examples. - Inq track record with the IG: As an IG player, I've read the fluff and understand that the track record for guardsmen NOT in the Inq wind up just as dead. If not in more numbers than if made to serve the Inq - Inq track record with marines (namely Soul Drinkers): I've not read the Omnibus, but from their info page alone, I can ascertain that the Soul Drinkers NEVER worked WITH the Inquisition. In fact, the Inquisition seems to have hunted them at every turn in their fluff.

Well time for constructive critisism, huh? That sounds so forced...
 * 1) First and foremost: this article requires urgent proofreading. I understand you are still writing it, but it still needs it.


 * 1) "They recruit from the most elite of the Guardsmen within their forces..." this is an extract from the article. It seems to me a bit strange that the guard regiment now attached to the chapter hosts child soldiers. Of course, I can swallow child soldiers, it just seems a bit strange. : P
 * 2) "Dark Kin" this refers to Dark Eldar, no? In this context, it seems a bit off place. "Kin" relates to relatives of sorts, and when it's article about humans (mostly), it falls a bit off. Well, just my oppinion, but honest one.
 * 3) Sign your messages, ArcCaptain
 * 4) Instead of telling people to "read the fluff", point them to book and page, or to Lex article if that seems a better way
 * 5) And as last thing: our policy is not fine with the permanent Guard/Inquisitor detachment, which this quite clearly is.

I enforce policies written down on this site, you might as well forget anything ever related to such thing as "canonicity", my job is to enforce rules. This article is non canon friendly as stated in this site's canon policy, to the point where the canon policy is, for whatever reasons, rewritten. We have all agreed to follow this site's rules, when signed in on this site, and so we shall. None is exempt from the rules. -- Remos talk 17:39, November 21, 2014 (UTC)

Fair enough on the siting part Remos. However, the way you personally perceive the fluff is not indicative of the rules your site has for me to follow. "Dark Kin" is a widely used term to denote the Dark Eldar. So just because you have perceived it as some relative to one of my forces, doesn't mean everyone else will. Secondly on the matters of the recruitment. Recruitment from elite human soldiers still young enough for gene/organ implantation is not unheard of. The Alphic Hydras have been said to be recruited by the Ultramarines. This can be found in Codex: Militarum Tempestus. So I find myself unsure of why you assume they are child-soldiers. Finally, I find myself asking why you still fixate your attention on fluff that simply isn't there. The constant reiteration of my Guardsmen being "attached" to the marines has me scratching my head and wondering if it is an attempt to troll and get under my skin to make me fly off the handle. I'm certainly not accusing anyone of it, I'm just saying that if it is indeed the case, I won't be flying off the handle and the uncivilized childish attempts should stop right here.As far as #5 is concerned, your policy is not fine with following fluff? Secondly, nothing in my fluff says they will permanently be attached. Finally, please pick one. Are you accusing me of attaching guard to marines or permanently attaching them to an Inquisitor? ArcCaptain (talk) 18:07, November 21, 2014 (UTC)